Gorlan
GM Class
Dev
The best way to achieve balance is to remove everything from the scale%\0\%
Posts: 152
Leagues Played: Club League, Falnorian
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Post by Gorlan on Jan 8, 2013 9:44:58 GMT -8
On another note, what has become of the militia? Are they all undead now?
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 10:03:14 GMT -8
Prolly just that one group. The other group agreed to stand down a bit, and there are probably more groups out there which require speaking to.
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Gorlan
GM Class
Dev
The best way to achieve balance is to remove everything from the scale%\0\%
Posts: 152
Leagues Played: Club League, Falnorian
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Post by Gorlan on Jan 8, 2013 10:06:31 GMT -8
How many were in the group? I shouldn't have mentioned vampires. *facepalm*
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 10:26:14 GMT -8
12ish? And... Actually... Yesterday Shailar came up with something that I've kinda been playing with in my head for a bit. If some of them become sired-bys then we can make the claim that the militia has been infiltrated by vampires. It's a partial truth, but it may be enough to get the militia to turn on itself if they can't tell the difference... Just a thought.
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Gorlan
GM Class
Dev
The best way to achieve balance is to remove everything from the scale%\0\%
Posts: 152
Leagues Played: Club League, Falnorian
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Post by Gorlan on Jan 8, 2013 10:33:52 GMT -8
So you're saying that the situation would be better if more people were killed. I think it is probably best to deal with the vampires as opposed to having witch trials going on. Why do we want the militia to turn on itself? I think we have to show them that we are the people responsible for protecting them. Also the orcs and urukai seem to be a powerful force. Some were even in classes. Maybe we enlist them to help in the places we and the elementals are not?
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 15:01:13 GMT -8
I am saying that a way of dealing with the militia until we are strong enough to take on vampires would be to get them to focus on trying to find vampires within their ranks. Which yes, given the fact that they are militia, will probably involve death. Call it cold if you want, but the militia is a weapon created by vampires, just like skeletons are a weapon created by vampires. The line of creation is just less direct. Shailar would tell you that we have given them the tools with which they can either learn sense or destroy themselves, and it is their choice which they decide to do.
We don't have the power or equipment to properly fight vampires yet, taking them out on our own will probably not work right now if they're any higher level than sired-by.
Attempting to enlist the assistance of the urukai and orcs is something we might try... But when was the last time you wanted to protect a group of people who murdered your comrades? The militia is a useful tool to prevent us from allying ourselves with them. That said, it is worth the attempt and less likely to cause long term loss of party members.
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Gorlan
GM Class
Dev
The best way to achieve balance is to remove everything from the scale%\0\%
Posts: 152
Leagues Played: Club League, Falnorian
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Post by Gorlan on Jan 8, 2013 15:56:33 GMT -8
The Urukai I spoke with seemed to want to fight a lot, also the ogres. I think it would be better to send the militia off looking for things that don't exist. While that is happening we go and help summon as many of the elementals and such as possible. Once we hit 1st tier it will be much easier. However the militia were not killing us. Where as some orcs were. How were the iron disciples started? I imagine it was a situation much like this.
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 16:02:09 GMT -8
The militia was killing the Orcs and Urukai though, and if people are to be believed, they did so without provocation. The first Urukai we talked to claimed to have been attacked while attempting to hunt down bandits. The groups after that thought we were militia. Which... Makes sense given that we too were roaming the countryside with weapons and a decent percentage of humans.
I suppose though... Lets see if we can find the first couple urukai we spoke to. They wanted fighting, but they didn't seem to want to piss off the humans until after they were attacked. That might be a point we could use to convince them to be helpful...
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Gorlan
GM Class
Dev
The best way to achieve balance is to remove everything from the scale%\0\%
Posts: 152
Leagues Played: Club League, Falnorian
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Post by Gorlan on Jan 8, 2013 16:17:58 GMT -8
What if we have the Militia defend the masters as they summon stuff? Or defend people doing fake rituals?
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 16:36:34 GMT -8
...That might work. That's a good idea. And then we could see if the orcs and urukai could help fight vampires once we've dealt with the militia. (They benefit from it, so...) That would be good!
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ZackAttack
GM Class
Zack
Do you like my hat?
Posts: 72
Leagues Played: Battle League, Character League, Club League, Adult League, Crestfall, Falnorian, Life, Teriock
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Post by ZackAttack on Jan 8, 2013 19:00:40 GMT -8
Deal with the militia however you want, as long as it doesn't involve sowing more fear and death among them. Granted, I don't have any better ideas, but I am against it.
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 19:31:32 GMT -8
Dev has come up with an alternative to sowing seeds of fear and death, assuming the militia buys it. Due to reasons of general ethics and not wanting to hate myself, I'd lik to try his plan before anything else.
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Gorlan
GM Class
Dev
The best way to achieve balance is to remove everything from the scale%\0\%
Posts: 152
Leagues Played: Club League, Falnorian
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Post by Gorlan on Jan 8, 2013 20:00:00 GMT -8
Are the masters planning on summoning more elementals? Otherwise it may not work well.
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Post by ElfChild on Jan 8, 2013 22:07:56 GMT -8
Dunno. If not, we can fake one.
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Post by Celebfealor on Jan 8, 2013 22:21:54 GMT -8
Hello. This is your friendly neighborhood conscience coming to show you why those plans are a bad idea.
The militia (now referred to as PMoS because militia is annoying to type) are *not bad people*. Honestly, can you blame them for what they're doing? They're scared, and they want to protect their families and their homes and their country from the Dark City on their doorstep, and from other more minor threats. Pacifism wasn't working out for them, so they switched tactics. It's called survival, and just because they're not doing what we wish they were doing doesn't make them bad people, and it doesn't make them deserving of the kind of throwing them away to vampires that people are talking about.
Listen to yourselves. You're talking about throwing people away to become vampires and tear each other apart. Is that okay? No. Is that any different then what you proclaim to be defending against - which is to say, vampires - would do? No, not really. Thankfully you've gotten off that topic and are simply thinking about ways of deceiving them instead.
Point: deception is a temporary solution. It gets them off our backs for now, but it causes problems later on. How about we give them real things to defend against and, even if we absolutely hate taking the time to do it, actually give real, reasonable arguments against what they're doing? These seem like the kind of people who go on action, not words and empty promises. If we can actually show them that, yes, we can defend them properly, and yes, pacifism really is a viable option, then we will have created a much more solid, long-lasting solution. And if we do it the right way, then we have allies by the end of this - not enemies. We need the former far, far more than we need the latter.
Disclaimer: I am only half coherent right now, so this may be completely lopsided.
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